saint venant 1940-------farm boulet

**ivor43** · 04-05-2013, 10:53

Jim.
Interesting post.
But let us break this down into something more manageable.
On 27th May Anthony is seen, by a reliable witness, with wounds that are not thought to be serious. at a position somewhere along the Lys Canal possibly somewhere between St Venant and St Floris. Awaiting treatment from a German Medical Aid Team. As he was unable to walk at that time this treatment would presumably have required Hospitalisation.
Where ? Would the German aid post have had the facilities to deal with this or would he have been taken to the local hospital. Where, St Venant or Calonne.
Whichever, he was KNOWN, as it would appear that a record must have been started in his name.
On 29th he is Certified Dead. How or why is really not important at the moment. What is important is the fact that whatever this documentation, when it is made available to the British Authorities, it is accepted as proof of Date of Death. Do we know when this amendment was made?
Now, with regard to this documentation. Whilst i obviously do not know what applied in wartime conditions, in normal circumstances the only persons authorised to sign a Death Cert are, a Doctor, a Pathologist or a Coroner. In this case if Anthony was in Hospital then obviously a Doctor would have been available, so a Legal Death Cert could have been issued, which would have been acceptable to our authorities.
I believe you are right, Anthony was never missing, while he was alive.

ivor

**dcdl12976** · 04-05-2013, 12:57

Not sure about France but in the USA. In Texas, for example, a justice of the peace can sign.

It may be that a JP can sign the certificate in France as well, just a thought.

Cheers

Dave

**dcdl12976** · 04-05-2013, 16:33

I have been trying to find the !st Btn Berkshies war diary for the time, i believe i may have found it. What has happened is that for some reason it is not in the search criteria on the Wadrobes site, however on going to the war diaries purchase page there is one advertised as the 1/4th Btn however when you look at the picture it states 1st AND 4th Btn (so far as i am aware the 1/4th Btn only existed during the 1st WW). So i have sent for a copy to see if im correct you never know there just may be some comments that could assist in unraveling this query.

Oh by the way the 1/4th Btn was my Grandfathers unit in WW1 and contains the following :

 1916-06-19

Regiment.	1/4th Royal Berkshire
Location	France, Hebuterne
Entry	Working parties as on the 18th. A and C Companies relieved B and D Coys by 7.0p.m. Divisional Cards were received from the GOC for Distinguished Conduct in the Field on the night of the 15/16th May - names below. Their guns were more active all the day, chiefly 15c.m., and their machine guns hardly stopped firing all night on our front. Weather:- Capt R G Attride 2/Lt H M Wells Lt D J Ward 2/Lt G S Field 2443 Sergt Pitman, C 2171 L/Sergt Page, A 2646 L/C Cooke, W 3051 Pte Drewitt, A J 2834 Pte Shaw, E Remarks Casualties:- 1 Died of wounds, 1 wounded.

1916-08-24

Regiment.	1/4th Royal Berkshire
Location	France, Ovillers
Entry	Companies were practiced in Bomb throwing etc. in the morning. Digging parties of 75 each from B and D Coys were found, leaving at 9.15p.m. for the work in the front line. Owing to the continual shelling all night by the enemy not much work was possible. Weather:- a fine day. Military Medals for immediate awards granted to Corporal RICE: Corporal COOKE: L/Corporal RUSSELL: Private MITCHELL: Private SMITH.

Cheers now

Dave

**dcdl12976** · 06-05-2013, 09:20

I knpow this isnt strictly relevant for which i appologise folks but i have just ordered a book which may have some info "The History of The Royal Berkshire Regiment 1920-1947" by Gordon Blight. It gives an day by day account of the withdrawl of the Berkshire Regiment from La Tombe in Belgium through to Dunkirk and even describes how at St Venant the battalion HQ was attacked on 27th May 1940. you never know we may gain a snippet or two from this.

Cheers

Dave

teecee1941 · 07-05-2013, 23:58

Good evening, gents. It's a while since I was on here but I know that Jim has kept you well up to date with what is, or isn't happening. At the moment I am waiting for a development in connection with the MP's investigations. I've had two or three contacts with the CWGC and they say they will be back in touch. I think this is unlikely because my last email to them did not show them in the best light. They told me that there was only one casualty in Saint Venant on the 29th May but we know that there were two, Anthony Corkhill and Syd Walt. I'll wait a while to see if they get back to me before contacting them again. About three or four weeks ago I had the delight and privilege to speak with 100 year old DLI veteran Arthur Willis of Eston, near Middlesbrough. Arthur was amazingly lucid and comprehensible for a man of his age and we talked for a good while. It was an enjoyable experience. Although Arthur had been in the St Venant area at the same time as Anthony, unfortunately the two had never met. Coincidentally, Arthur had done a bit of boxing during his posting to France, as had Anthony. Thanks again to all who have taken the time to read and be involved in this thread. I am still very hopeful for a successful result.

**Verrieres** · 08-05-2013, 00:44

In addition to Tonys enquiries I made an approach to the CWGC in relation to the circumstances/place of death of Pte Syd Walt ,a different contact but a `Joe Public` answer..this is what I asked................

Could you please let me know if you hold information relating to where Pte Syd Walt of The 2nd Durham Light Infantry died I am aware through eyewitness testimony that he was wounded two days earlier on the 27th May 1940. Do you know where he was when he died on the 29th May 1940.(Hospital etc)I am aware he was wounded near St Venant and rests in the St Venant Communal Cemetery at that location.Thank you for your consideration on this matter

Today the reply was ;-

Thank you for your e-mail of 21st March 2013 regarding Private Sydney Walt.<O:P></O:P>
Unfortunatelty I am unable to assist you with your request. This is because the Commission does not hold details regarding the circumstances of death of a casualty. The details we do hold I give below:-<O:P></O:P>
Casualty Details<O:P></O:P>
Rank: Private<O:P></O:P>
Surname: WALT<O:P></O:P>
Forenames: SYDNEY<O:P></O:P>
Service No: 4449017<O:P></O:P>
Age: 26<O:P></O:P>
Unit: 2nd Bn.<O:P></O:P>
Regiment: Durham Light Infantry<O:P></O:P>
Date of Death: 29 May 1940<O:P></O:P>
Additional Information<O:P></O:P>
Son of Thomas William Walt, and of Florence Beatrice Walt, of Hutton Magna, Yorkshire.<O:P></O:P>
Commemoration<O:P></O:P>
ST. VENANT COMMUNAL CEMETERY, Pas de Calais, France, Plot 3. Row A. Grave 20.

I am sorry I have been unable to help yopu with your request.<O:P></O:P>

Yours sincerely<O:P></O:P>

All of that information is available on the website,they are sticking to the basics whats it going to take to change that ? or do we believe they hold nothing else? If they do`nt who does?
Remember what proof they require in relation to the erection of Headstones,the proof beyond doubt that the graves in question do infact hold the men that are inscribed on that stone then ask yourself based on the information they claim to hold would that be enough to satisfy any of their own criteria?

Best

Jim

**dcdl12976** · 08-05-2013, 18:01

So once again they insist they have nothing more than what is on the website (and have claimed they didnt know about some of that) strikes me they just are not looking any further than there e-mails. I wonder sometimes is this because they cant be bothered or do they have some information they either dont want to release or are being told not to release. To be honest this stinks of either inefficiency or a cover up for some reason. Of course it could just be plain bone idleness on the part of the clerks answering the E-Mails.
Strikes me this is something for the MP who may just get them to look further than there noses.

Cheers
Dave

PS one of the books (The History of The Royal Berkshire Regiment 1920-1947) has been despatched and so should be here tomorrow or Friday. I dont hold out much hope but maybe there will be something in there we can use.

**dcdl12976** · 10-05-2013, 18:05

Ok folks here is the first part of details of the Royal Berks at St Venant, nothing of help to Anthony im afraid but interesting (to me at anyrate).

 MAY 24^th
It was not until the morning of the 24^th that the 1^st battalion clambered once more into buses and sped by way of Genech and Seclin to La Bassee. The road had been bombed, and was congested with traffic and swarms of refugees moving in all directions. After waiting for two hours at La Fosse, north of La Bassee , they were told that the Germans were already near Merville ahead of them, but that they should continue there move, protected by their carrier platoon and seize the bridges over the Aire canal at Guarbecque south west of St Venant .
After passing through Mervill, where the situation was obscure and the confusion considerable the bus column came to a stop and the battalion spent the tail end of the night resting where they were.

May 25^th
In the morning the move was continued by two routes; one direct to Guabecque by way of St Venant, and the other direct to Haverskerque, a village between the Lys and the Foret de Nieppe. The information given to the battalion belittled the likelihood of much organise opposition, in the way that official uncertainty often adopts. It was not long before the southern column directed to St Venant had every reason to distrust it. The bridge over the Lys had been partially destroyed, and its defenders lay dead by the roadside. Hasty repairs enabled the troops to pass over. Soon after German artillery opened a heavy fire and several casualties at once ensued among whom Captain E.S Hall was killed. As the companies advanced towards Guarbeque heavy machine gun fire directed from a factory south of the Aire canal prevented further lateral movement without the weight and range that could only come from artillery support. This was not available. By nightfall the battalion held forward of the long bend of the Lys canal between St Venant and the Forest, with battalion headquarters in Bas Hamel and C Company in reserve behind Haverskerque. On the right was a week pioneer battalion and on the left the 2^nd Durham Light Infantry.

i will try to do some more over the weekend if people are interested.

Commanding officer Lieutenant Colonel M.C Dempsey MC later General Sir M.C Dempsey K.C.B, K.B.E, D.S.O, M.C, A.D.C

Cheers

Dave

**dcdl12976** · 11-05-2013, 08:26

May 26^th
The battalion remained in the same position the next day, undisturbed except by shelling and suffering some casualties in the process, among whom were Lt L.J.L Hill and Captain C.N. B Dawson both wounded. Although the latter officer could no longer walk he insisted on remaining at his post being one of the few officers left. Platoon Sergeant Major Harvey now became commander of D company. (The rank held was introduced shortly before the war with the object of securing young, tactically trained leaders to meet the shortage of junior officers. These warrant officers Class III of the battalion amply justified there selection but the experiment ceased in the Army in 1943- with the retention of rank only by those men holding it.)
In contrast to the comparative peace of Sunday -not to be confused with the sabbatical calm at home- the night that followed was full of incident. Parties of enemy had crossed the Lys with roving tanks sometime previously; they now began to interfere in the rear area of the battalion, blocking the road back to Haverskerque. Sgt T. Williams was sent with the carrier platoon to tidy up the position. They soon came into contact with enemy armour and in the fight that followed several carriers were destroyed. The road was never the less secured.

**dcdl12976** · 11-05-2013, 11:37

Heres the last part folks all its done is show the situation from the point of view of the third battalion in the brigade unfortunatlely.

Hope you find it interesting though.

 May 27^th
On the following morning the tension increased and enemy attacks became general everywhere. Battalion Headquarters itself was attacked at dawn and in the dog-fight that followed clerks, orderlies and batmen became closely engaged. The second in command Major H. Rew organised a successful counter attack and restored the situation with the same tolerant nonchalance that attends manoeuvres when the august of a unit suffer indignities at the hands of an enterprising but slightly too exuberant an enemy. The enemy attack finally subsided with the arrival of the reserve company. A discreet battalion withdrawal under heavy fire followed.

The battalion next halted on a position east of Haverskerque behind the Lys canal where it covered the withdrawal of the brigade transport into the forest. As they turned to go two particularly large enemy tanks appeared and opened machine gun fire at the scattered parties of men- they were now about a company strong crossing an open stretch of ground before reaching the leafy embrasures of the forest. Astonishingly few casualties were sustained but everyone there had reason to congratulate themselves that these tanks were handled with considerable discretion otherwise the encounter was likely to have had a different outcome. After emerging from the protecting trees they were again met by fire and luckily again it had little effect but the situation was rapidly becoming very unpleasant. The battalion moved on under orders for Cuadesqure two miles away where they became concentrated within the brigade and spent an uneventful night. There total strength then was twelve officers, 200 men and six serviceable Bren guns.

May 28^th
That morning the 1^st battalion marched away from the trampled banks of the Lys the torn woods and the harbouring village of Caudesqure.