Out on their Brigadiers

[Braz]

Just read a piece in todays Sun.

Military Top Brass will be Culled so more Funds can be released for Front Line Troops. Up to 17 Brigadiers each on between £95,000 and £115,00 a year could go to free up more Funds.

What about getting rid of some MPs or better still some of them that are in Cardiff Bay? Braz.

[Gwyn Nicholas]

I agree with scrapping some MP'S but lets be fair there are probably a lot of Senior Officers like Brigadiers (who dont actually command Brigades) getting paid to do jobs that do not really require Brigadier rank (and therefore wage) to do so. Many of us left after 22 years service simply because we were 40 years old and therefore on the scrap heap. Amazingly doddering old Officers seem to be still at their best and worthy of employment until they are close to senility, jobs for the boys in other words. It makes me titter when I hear all the moans and groans about cuts. We all know they are needed to sort this country out but, "as long as it doesn't affect me its acceptable" seems to be the order of the day. That civil servant on the news yesterday remarked, "soldiers win the battles but back room boys win the wars" probably has a point but how many non-commanding Brigadiers to you need in the back room to advise commanding Brigadiers on the ground how to win the war. Money for old rope jobs need to go - do your time, get a job and move on like the rest of us mere mortals would be advice to any Brigadier moaning about losing his cushy job. That goes for Generals too.

[nasher546]

Spot on Gwyn, couldn't have put it better myself. The only trouble is I believe they would not be able to move on like the rest of us. Just don't think they have the metal to adapt to the real world.

I agree with scrapping some MP'S but lets be fair there are probably a lot of Senior Officers like Brigadiers (who don't actually command Brigades) getting paid to do jobs that do not really require Brigadier rank (and therefore wage) to do so. Many of us left after 22 years service simply because we were 40 years old and therefore on the scrap heap. Amazingly doddering old Officers seem to be still at their best and worthy of employment until they are close to senility, jobs for the boys in other words. It makes me titter when I hear all the moans and groans about cuts. We all know they are needed to sort this country out but, "as long as it doesn't affect me its acceptable" seems to be the order of the day. That civil servant on the news yesterday remarked, "soldiers win the battles but back room boys win the wars" probably has a point but how many non-commanding Brigadiers to you need in the back room to advise commanding Brigadiers on the ground how to win the war. Money for old rope jobs need to go - do your time, get a job and move on like the rest of us mere mortals would be advice to any Brigadier moaning about losing his cushy job. That goes for Generals too.

[nash929]

Never a truer story, but it would seem it is the same where ever you go today Nick, ian.

[Baconwallah]

Although I fully agree with everything said here, I don't think it's that simple. Sacking a number of Brigadiers sounds good and gives the public the impression that the government is actually doing something. But the money disappearing into various Private Finance Initiatives would be equivalent to an army of brigadiers, and nobody talks about that.
The ridiculous plans to privatise training have already cost enormous sums with nothing to show for it. Some years ago it was RAF maintenance which had to be concentrated and run privately, far too costly and destroying some very expensive assets in the process. Qinetiq has been privatised and is now a happy hunting ground for managers and other boot fillers. And then there are the many IT projects which are several times over budget, years late and ultimately doomed.
That is where the real savings can be found.
Unfortunately all these bottomless pits represent the pet projects of politicians and are therefore taboo. Much easier to sack twenty brigadiers.

[Paul Hinge]

I concur with all you've said but there's one organisation in the UK that's a bigger drain on the finances because there are so many pen pushing managers and executives who get highly inflated salaries that are protected and that's the NHS.
Here in Wales in the recent reorganisation of the NHS 137 senior managers/executives had no job to do following the re-organisation but guess what....their on gardening leave for up to 10 years on full pay that's scandalous.
We need more frontline staff i.e. the recruitment of permanent Nurses and Doctors is on hold yet they still employ pen pushers.
The management organisation of non-clinical and medical staff needs to be dismantled completely and a leaner more effective model put in its place!

Hingey

[Keith Jones 989]

Don't be fooled by talks of cuts. I was in Osnabruck with the Devon and Dorsets in 1976 when they reviewed the 'Task Force' and 'Field Force' command structure with a view to reducing the number of Brigadiers on the books. Before the review Osnabruck had TWO resident Brigadiers. After the review Osnabruck had THREE resident Brigadiers!

[Baconwallah]

I concur with all you've said but there's one organisation in the UK that's a bigger drain on the finances because there are so many pen pushing managers and executives who get highly inflated salaries that are protected and that's the NHS.
Here in Wales in the recent reorganisation of the NHS 137 senior managers/executives had no job to do following the re-organisation but guess what....their on gardening leave for up to 10 years on full pay that's scandalous.
We need more frontline staff i.e. the recruitment of permanent Nurses and Doctors is on hold yet they still employ pen pushers.
The management organisation of non-clinical and medical staff needs to be dismantled completely and a leaner more effective model put in its place!

Hingey

Very true. I know it from the inside. I remember asking for one more nurse for several years, only to be told that there was no money. But to my surprise there was enough money for five extra cluster managers.
Ninety percent of the current management structure should be dismantled. Many of these useless mouths earn as much as or more than a consultant, but I never saw one of them in theatre at three in the morning.

John

[Gwyn Nicholas]

Just to clarify my post, (as it only refererred to Brigadiers in this case) It is not just the military that has a "jobs for the boys", it is rife in every large outfit and particularly in the public sector. The NHS has been mentioned and I'm sure other Orgs will have similar stories. I can remember(some years ago) when Doctors complained that much of their long hours were due to the paperwork they had to do, then more recently the Police complaining that paperwork takes up so much of their time that they are not out on the beat doing their job. Well I'm afraid that was a perfect "in" for the penpushing bureaucrats who were willing to push paper and walk around with mil board like the preverbial "busy" COS. They of course look after their own so each senior secretary had a junior secretary and an office junior the first to answer a phone the second to type the letters and the junior to file, photocopy, sort mail and make tea/coffee for the whole caboosh. My answer is teach the junior how to type and answer the phone as she is already doing 80% of the work anyway then get rid of one of the posers. 30% staff saving. Politicians of course are right up there, whether local Government or the big boys in London, there are plenty of savings to be found but what Government official will actually volunteer to do more work. As I said, cuts are fine, "as long as they dont affect me" is the word. What good is sacking a few Brigadiers.....it's a start and long may it continue throughout the Public sector. Lets see if this lot really have the guts to do something or whether it is a smoke screen to keep Joe public happy.