What Would You Do?

[chow]

In my humble opinion,
you do the job you are payed for.
or you find another job,.. simple...

[Gwyn Nicholas]

I think Mike has a valid point. There will always be those who will take advantage of a situation to suit personal ambition or gain. The Raping and pillaging in the Napoleonic wars, a crime punishable by death yet often "overlooked" by many senior commanders as a "supplement" to the soldiers pay. Stealing from dead soldiers on the battlefields under the guise of searching for intelligence information. (maps etc). The atrocoties commited by the Nazis and those in Bosnia all supposedly "following orders".
Even in Northern Ireland there were case of soldiers overstepping the mark and punished for it. ("Lets go crack some skulls" is a term I recall quite vividly) I do feel however, that now more than ever, commanders on the ground are prepared to question the rights and wrongs of the situation and indeed this is backed up by the Senior Officers whom in recent times have made a stand, spoken out and even resigned their commissions rather than continue to do something they find either morally wrong or badly supported by the powers that be. The fact remains, it's a dirty job but somebody has to do it or anarchy will ensue and that is a road we really do not want to go down.

Dusty I also enjoy listening to the Carpenters, I am totally in touch with my feminine side but I do draw the line at wearing PINK! It was also more than the "occasional" pint as my bank manager will bare witness.

[jungle1810]

Hello All,
Re the trouble over the referendum of the Lisbon treaty, and civil disobediance. Firstly if any trouble broke out in Wales at the turn of the century it is highly possible that troops from another part of Britain would be sent to quell the riots (Anarchy) The Lisbon treaty was turned down by 3 countries (France, Ireland, and the Dutch). This was conveniently ignored by the mandarins of Europe and the UK. So with bribes and other motives these three countries were ordered to hold another referendum until the required vote was obtained, even if the Lisbon treaty was still 90% of the original cause of saying NO. The point made by many of the forum scribes were spot on. If you take the Queens shilling you do exactly as ordered.But a fact I find most depressing is we were refused a referendum by an unelected PM after their manifesto stated we would have the benefit of being consulted on the "So called new Lisbon Treaty" how come when the dice come out against the European Mandarins they can conjure up 3 more referenda P.D.Q. And use strong arm methods to make Poland and Czechoslovakia sign up to nullify the UK's wishes. I am most annoyed that the UK can be disenfranchised by an unelected PM. That is what is most annoying with the state of UK politics
in the UK

RBD

[neil(george)wilson]

My view is and always was is that if an individual voluntary signs up to join the Army then he is obliged, without question, to follow the orders of the government of the day his employers. Governments of the day however, are not as stupid as they appear. They don't usually send in, troops to sort out civil unrest of same national peoples. What I mean by that is, when I was serving in N. Ireland I never once saw an Irish Ranger there? As for a referendum I think we've lost it anyway, aren't we run from Brussels all ready?

N.G.

[Davies GW]

If we assume that the level of unrest was big enough that the police force couldn't cope and the military was called in to assist then we are looking at a potential civil war. At this point, a soldier would have to consider his own feelings on the subject. His decision needs to be based on what he feel is best for his country.

At the start of every military career you swear an oath to the Queen her heirs and successors and promise to obey the orders of those that she places above you. If you feel that to continue in this service is to act against the best interests of the people of the UK then I would say that you are actually duty bound to refuse to serve. We swore an oath to the Queen but really it was a promise to defend the British people.

Soldiers get little or no ethical training, it is unnecessary and could be obstructive. If you have a soldier analysing the ethics of every shot fired then people will die while he makes the decision. The reality is that the politicians set soldiers objectives and at the point that those objectives become unethical then a soldier is duty bound to refuse to carry them out. The Nuremburg trials blew the " I was only obeying orders" defence out of the water.

This is all ideal world stuff, in reality, I suspect that the police would call for assistance and the great majority of serving troops would answer call.

The question is what would I do?? Ask me when it happens.

[HOWIE WILLIAMS]

Any community's arm of force - military, police, security - needs people in it who can do necessary evil, and yet not be made evil by it. To do only the necessary and no more. To constantly question the assumptions, to stop the slide into atrocity.