Joining the Euro

[Paul Hinge]

Gwyn
This is becoming a very interesting debate!
Yes there are problems and that's my worry. even when we were 9 nation-states in the EEC we had trouble policing the law so at 29 we have even less chance. I can still be pro the concept but still have reservations on how it's managed! A VETO is a VETO. You and I cannot dictate to member states how they ratify at teaty or not. Ireland knows that they rely soley on the EU for their economic viability so opting out of any treaty will have a detrimental effect on their trade. They voted NO last year as the anti-abortion lobby etc. played the card that the EU would insist on abortion becoming law in Ireland which of course was total bu**s**t. If we were in a conferderation such as the Warsaw Pact we wouldn't even had a vote so democracy at some level is being exercised.

Hingey

[Gwyn Nicholas]

Hingey, we do not have a vote which is one of my points, and a Democracy at "some level" is not Democracy. Great Britain is supposed to be a Democratic country not a country with "some level" of democracy. The European union is fast becoming (in my opinion) less of a democracy and more of a Tyranical State. Look how much we have had to change our culture already, stupid laws that cannot be policed like the changes to metric in shops. Brussels telling us that this tiny island can and should keep taking immigrants even though our health service, schools, housing and other services cannot cope. The fact is, we are different people from different cultures and human nature dictates that one or more of the stronger cultures will push for their own to be accepted and adopted. Not the ideal recipe for the peace that you talk of. I dont trust our own politicians right now (for well documented reasons) let alone want my future and the future of this country be decided by a bunch of faceless foreign ones. My main grouch however remains the same and that is, WE ARE NOT BEING ASKED, and we want to be!

[Paul Hinge]

Gwyn

I agreee with you entirely about being asked via a referendum. The problem is the 2 political parties that have given away our soverignty to the EU namely the Tories and Labour, both will not give the country a choice. Brown has already signed the Lisbun Treaty and Cameron is playing politics saying that if its not ratified before the election they will hold a referendum whilst behind the scenes his party are applying pressure on the Cech's as they did on the Pole's to sign asap. Please don't believe the rhetoric in the press they want to keep the status quo as they thirst for power!

Hingey

[Gwyn Nicholas]

Hingey

As far as the press and all politicians go, I am the original "Doubting Thomas" I can assure you. I believe in what I can see. So far, I have seen one man ignore the wants of this country -fact. I now wait to see if the other man speaks with fork tongue as you suggest - Spin, not yet fact. I know very little about politics which probably puts me in the majority in this country. I therefore have to put my trust in those, who do know what they are about and hope (yes hope) they do their best for us. Most of all I want a PM and a Government who are not afraid of making and enforcing our own Laws to deal with the crime, from its lowest form (anti-social behaviour - the blight of our streets) to illegal immigration and terrorism. The rights of criminals has become more important than those of the victim thanks to the interference from countries who do not suffer from the same crime problems that we do. Human rights and political correctness has gone mad in this country, due purely to the interference from Europe. That in a nutshell is basically why I am not Pro-European.

[Paul Hinge]

Hi Gwyn

Can I share with you some of your concerns especially at what is termed lower scale criminal acts.
My 3 children all work in frontline public service eldest Justin (ex RWF as well) is a Policeman and he'll tell you crim's and kids today have no regard for the law whatsoever because the sanctions are not rigid enough.
The other two work in the A&E department of a General Hospital and they see and have to deal with the problems society has brought upon itself day in day out, verbal abuse and physical abuse, they have had to be trained in how to restrain such cases because the NHS cannot afford to employ security 24/7.Have you heard the like of it?
I see Paul Nash has been looking in on this thread. He works in the Prison Service. Is it true Paul these prisoners have flat screen televisions, computers and play stations to pas away the time whilst they are serving their sentences. A bit of time in the nick with Ravenhill might be something to consider!

Every 2 years the Justice services i.e. Courts and Probation service have to come and tedll us as councillors why and how the dole out sentences. This year they went away under no illusion that we were,speaking on behalf of the communities we represent not happy at all with the leniency of sentences being given out. The Justice system is supposed to be there to provide in the first place a credible punishment to offenders and the feeling on the ground is they don't. This has been endemic in society since the 1970's.
We need to teach children from a very young age self respect and to respect others and I'm afraid that is sadly lacking in the society we live in.
It's not EU law that has done this it's our politicans it's the way they have fashioned society.
One last point,there is a case I know of where a practising senior magistrate has broken a law and has been sent for prosecution and the system thought it could protect one of its own by placing the case out of county and region to be heard. Well as you can imagine someone who knows someone whose a friend of a person who saw this being listed has brought it to the public's attention. What hope have we got in society today when things like that occur. If you or I did it we'd be hung drawn and quartered by the system. Which is what I hope will happen to this Magistrate.

Hingey

[Gwyn Nicholas]

Hingy

Your point time spent with Nick Ravenhill in the slammer is a good one and I am in total agreement. That though is the point. We are at the moment, treating offenders with kid gloves simply because of the European Human Rights Charter/Bill which in my opinion and that of many in this country goes to far, hence the outcry for our own Human Rights Bill. Basic Human Rights are necessary for obvious reasons, but they do conflict. For example I have the right to enjoy a peaceful life in my own home - the young have the right to move freely and enjoy themselves. When a group of ten or twelve of them camp outside my front gate making a racket (no damage) so loud that I cannot hear my own television who has the priority of "Rights". The Police cannot even answer that question right now, so the complexities of how a prisoner should be treated under European legislation must be mind boggling and that possibly is why prisoners (alledgedly) are treated so well in prison.

[Paul Hinge]

Gwyn
I'm glad we see eye-to-eye on something!

The Human Rights Act is really something else. this government was warned time and time again about its interpretation within the law courts and they chose to ignore the advice.

I'm shocked that the police would take that attitude regarding those kids. You quite eloquently pointed out the law as it stands states you are allowed to enjoy your home and it surrounds without interference from others. They are undertaking anti-social behaviour and the police have many powers from moving them on to arrest to deal with these kids.

My eldest (policeman) deals with this type of issue on a day-to-day basis and as we have both stated it has come about because society has been allowed to deteriorate to this level where respect for others is just not COOL!

Hingey