Regimental pioneer's

**Rog Ball 01** · 21-09-2008, 11:48

So that clears everything up I think. I was part righ bouy Bearskin but wrong about the sword, and for that I apologise.

Do 2 Royal Welsh have Pioneers? And if they do, what is the dress worn by the Pioneer SNCO? Is it the same as for the RRW?

**Pegleg** · 21-09-2008, 22:53

Originally Posted by johnnye63

When I was a Sgt I had the sword but no bearskin, I only had that once, but the sword was part of the Pioneers sgt's dress.

john nye

you always looked good in scarlets 'Boss' ,

**Bri Brazier** · 22-09-2008, 09:25

2 Royal Welsh do not have an Assault Pioneer Platoon.

**Rog Ball 01** · 22-09-2008, 09:38

Good to hear that Braz. So the Royal Welch traditions will live on.

**johnnye63** · 22-09-2008, 18:25

To be fair I look good in anything, but thanks any way.

**anitacorbett** · 22-09-2008, 19:56

Originally Posted by johnnye63

To be fair I look good in anything, but thanks any way.

Love it when you're modest Bro!
Anita xx

bambi · 23-09-2008, 15:16

I have been a member of the pnr's since 1994 when it reformed in Haverfordwest, although i have been away from the Bn alot of my career doing Asslt/Pnr roll's, i can always remember Dia Martin wearing the Bearskin every time we done and parrades, he was only a Sgt in those days untill he got out as rank of a CSgt i do believe due to is accident.
i hope this helps a little,
BAMBI

beefy22 · 23-09-2008, 19:52

Bambi, you been away from the battlion that long, that we where combat 95, assault boots and not denims, putties & ammo boots.

stu reed · 23-09-2008, 23:15

when Bambi joined.. webbing was white wash leather, he was issued the Brown Bess musket and he got his bear skin from the French Imperial Guard.....

On another note..in the photo gallery theres a photo of Dai when he was the Pioneer Sgt wearing a "Bear Skin" and carrying a sword on this forum....in the 1990 part..

BobGBennett · 07-10-2008, 17:23

As an ex-Royal Welchmen and an Army historian perhaps I can help here. In the days before Warrant Officers (i.e. 1915) the Bearskin was originally worn by First Class Staff Serjeants and Officers. In those days a 'Staff Serjeant' was a collective term rather like 'Staff Officers' that grouped the senior NCOs at RHQ level (e.g.The Sjt Maj (later 'RSM') RQMS, Musketry Sjt, Armourer Sjt and so on).

In 1915 WO was introduced and the Sjt Maj became the RSM and the (then) 8 (A to F) Rifle Companies (each with a CSjt as senior man) were merged into 4 'double companies (A to D) with the senior CSjt becoming a new appt of CSM with the equally new 'rank' of WO2. The other CSjt became CQMS to mirror image the RQMS at battalion level.

This re-organisation took place throughout the Army with the TA following suit a year later. A a result of this organisation, most but not all of the original First Class Staff Serjeants became WO2 and therefore continued to wear the Bearskin. Others did not and were in effect downgraded in terms of status (not popular at the time!). Of the CSjts at company level, those who becasme the new CSMs were now WOs and got to wear the Bearskin and those who were CQMS did not.

In a nutshell it is Army Historical tradition (by Regulation) let alone RWF tradition, that officers and WOs wear the Bearskin and CSgts and below do not. The only exception to this is the Drum Major (originally and for very many years the Sjt Drummer) who wears the Bearskin by virtue of his 'appointment'. These principles apply to all 'dress distinctions' for the infantry and not just the RWF/Royal Welsh, irrespective of amalgamation.