Staying in the EU

hi..
an interesting set of figures..But figures can be twisted to suit a persons point of view.. ok the % of trade with the EU has fallen.. but it does not mention that there has been, i believe, a decline in Britain's manufacturing industry.with a number of traditionally British firms moving their bases to the old Eastern European countries to reduce the Cost of Manufacture . It could be said that the reduction British trade in EU trade is due to this. Also what it not mentioned is market competition. at one time the term ''Made in China'' was a possible indication of poor quality goods. that is no longer the case. Chinese goods are now of a good quality. but are produced much cheaper. so can claim a larger % of the market. I believe that to leave the EU would, if the price of Ex EU British goods increased it would reduce the Market % even further. Whilst i agree there are a number of issues within the EU it is not only UK that has problems.


ivor

I agree with the above but I have read that not being part of the EU opens up the markets to India and China for us which at present is restricted if you are a members of the EU.

Hi
while i agree with the above, i am not sure that we would gain any benefit from them. The problem is that although they appear to be potentially Vast Markets.are they ?. Yes they have Huge market potential..on paper. i think that a large % of the people are very poor, certainly in comparison with the West, so would they be able to afford Imported Goods, especially if they are higher priced than locally produced items.
The next problem is Steel. the UK no longer has any Steel industry. it was sold off to India,(Tata) which has now shut down most of the industry. Therefore we have to Buy Steel from India, or elsewhere. which is an added expense. So when you can no longer control the price of a commodity, you are at the mercy of market trends. The reason for the nosedive in British Steel has been the Over Production by the Cheaper Manufacturers. in the Belief of a Continued high demand from the Chinese market. This downturn in the Chinese Manufacturing industry, which possibly should have been foreseen. Has caused, and will continue to cause, major problems for some time. I read the other day that the Chinese stock markets lost about 7% of its value in a matter of hours forcing them to close.
I think, as a member of the EU, we may be shielded from some of these problems. But as an Independent Manufacturer with high production costs, i think we would have a serious struggle to compete with the EU, for any increased share of any Global Market.



ivor

If you watched the debate between Farage/Jones you will see one confident leader and one scaremonger.

Missed it so who is who ?????

hi.
I didn't watch that debate and i wont watch any politician on telly. The problem is, as i said before, figures and data and stuff can be and frequently is, Twisted to suit the particular persons point of view.. For instance, The most misused one is the Unemployment Figures. it is headlined '' 6% of working age Population on Dole or Benefit'' Big headlines. but would ''94% of population in Work'' have the same effect, i doubt it. It is Very Difficult to make any sort of Decision based on The Media as they all have their own particular Crusade.
My own Personal Feeling is, we should stay in the EU. We are in an age where the Multi National Companies Rule,sadly. and as a small island nation the UK does not have the Influence we once had, since we gave up the Commonwealth. So do we want to be a small fish swimming alone with the dangers of Sharks or the Financial Markets, or would we be better off as a member of a ''School'' where we have the protection of larger Numbers. I know what my choice is..


ivor

I'm not a fan of where the EU is currently, but I can see the validity of Ivor's comments in favour of staying in, they make very real sense. The problem is that it's been a huge experiment, run by faceless, unelected bureaucrats, and is not the trading group that we originally joined. I think anyone who votes purely on the immigration issue is making a huge mistake, there's a lot more to the in/out question than that subject. Also migrants/immigration is a developing story, Merkal is now under real pressure, following the Cologne incidents, Shengen is suspended following the Paris attacks and with more on the way, is likely to be even further watered down. So it's a changing narrative, but of course an important part of the debate, but not the only aspect of membership.

Also, World Wars. My parents generation were obsessed with this subject, as were theirs and rightly so. The longest period since 1945, when one of the big players in Europe hasn't been attacking another, something easily overlooked, but a very real fear throughout the 20th Cent, which is partly where the Common Market came from.

I'm one of those "undecideds" and I'm looking forward to Feb, when the negoiations are finished and the politicians are then open to proper scrutiny. If you are really interested in this subject, and want to see the politicians sweat, catch "The Daily Politics" every lunchtime on BBC2 with Andrew Neil and Jo Coburn…two of the finest analysts/interviewers , for my money, they're worth the licence fee alone.

"an interesting set of figures..But figures can be twisted to suit a persons point of view."

The figures on the fall in export ar facts, the reason for that is another story as you rightly pointed out Ivor, I have not seen the debate yet, I can see one scaremonger like Enoch Powell, right or wrong, the other, not a confident leader, well not on past performance anyway, Recently we have seen Cameron getting promises of large investments from India and China, Country's outside the EU.

The EU will not protect you from the rule of the multinationals, Ivor. On the contrary, if the current top secret EU-US trade negociations lead to an agreement, the multinational;s will rule the EU. Officially.

See http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...u-9779688.html

John

Just read in papers that the Amount of Benefits paid out to all these Immigrants will not be made known to the British Public as they fear it will make people vote against staying in Europe. Lord I dread to think what it must be, and to think our Pensioners would be better off in Prison. Braz